Possible mass bug filling for package depending on "menu".

[Please, reply/discuss <flame> .. </flame> separate thread.]


Introduction
==Lots of package seems to have some kind of dependency on "menu" which
aren't needed/useful. Therefore, removing the "menu" package on a
given system isn't always possible. Also, many packages seems depends,
recommends or suggests on the menu package, even though the dependency
isn't useful.

Intended Mass bug filling

I intend to submit a mass bug filling to ask packages maintainer to drop or
downgrade their dependency on "menu":

* If the package merely provides a menu entry (in /usr/share/menu/), then
any dependency on the menu package can and should be removed.
* Packages that actually "consume" menu information can and should depend
on the package menu in some way.
<flame>
A program (window manager...) that presents a menu to the user should
have a "depends" on menu if "Debian Menu" is the only menu system it
supports. If the program has a different preferred menu (typically the
XDG menu), then the dependency should be downgraded to recommend or
suggest. (see the note below regarding meta package)
</flame>

Meta packages that depend on "menu" are beyond the scope of this mail
because they often aim to provide a complete user environment.
(still, do consider that some user may want to uninstall "menu").

Alternatively, a Lintian test might test could be used.
After analyzing the package depending on menu (see below), I can to the
non-authoritative and unadvised conclusion that only the packages using the
menu (i.e providing a file in /etc/menu-methods/) and a very few meta package
can reasonably depend / recommend / suggest) on menu.

Rational
=IMHO, only applications that use the content of menu entries (the files in
/usr/share/menu/... like the window managers, panels..) should declare a
dependency. Package that merely provides a file in /usr/share/menu/ should not
declare a dependency menu. The rational is that it makes no difference
whether the "menu" package is installed or not... if the user's "window
manager" don't use those menu entries.

Also, most people [me] look for a program in only one place (menu). Having
two menu side by side was useful for transition, but nowadays it probably
seems awkward to many end-users. <flame>(not to mention that some people
may blame Debian for not adopting open standards).</flame>

[The list below were made on a debian-testing :-/ ]

Specious "depends" relationship [AFAICT]:
backintime-gnome - GNOME front-end for backintime
backintime-kde - KDE front-end for backintime
bleachbit - delete unnecessary files from the system
btnx-config - graphical user interface for btnx
bum - graphical runlevel editor
disk-manager - simple graphical filesystem configurator
firestarter - GTK program for managing and observing your firewall
gadmin-bind - GTK+ configuration tool for bind9
gadmin-openvpn-client - GTK+ configuration tool for openvpn (client)
gadmin-openvpn-server - GTK+ configuration tool for openvpn (server)
gadmin-proftpd - GTK+ configuration tool for proftpd
gadmin-rsync - GTK+ configuration tool for rsync
gadmin-samba - GTK+ configuration tool for samba
grub-choose-default - Control Grub Default through a GUI
gsmartcontrol - graphical user interface for smartctl
gsql - Integrated database development tool for GNOME
gtkorphan - A graphical tool to find and remove orphaned libraries
kvpnc - vpn clients frontend for KDE4
luckybackup - rsync-based GUI data backup utility
ndisgtk - graphical frontend for ndiswrapper (installation of Wind
rutilt - Configuration tool for rt2x00 wireless network cards
startupmanager - Grub, Usplash and Splash screen configuration
system-config-audit - Graphical utility for editing audit configuration
system-config-cluster - graphical configuration and management tool for Red Hat
system-config-lvm - A utility for graphically configuring Logical Volumes
wifi-radar - graphical utility for managing Wi-Fi profiles
xball - Simulate bouncing balls in a window
Legitimate "depends" [AFAICT]:
afterstep - window manager with the NEXTSTEP look and feel
awesome - highly configurable, next generation framework window ma
fluxbox - Highly configurable and low resource X11 Window manager
motif-clients - Open Motif - X11 clients (mwm, xmbind)
pekwm - very light window manager
twm - Tab window manager
junior-config - Debian Jr. Project common package
blends-common - Debian Pure Blends common package
science-config - Debian Science Project config package
task-desktop - Debian desktop environment
med-config - Debian Med general config package


Specious "recommends" relationship [AFAICT]:
dkms - Dynamic Kernel Module Support Framework
etherape - graphical network monitor
keytouch-editor - create keyboard files for keytouch
lynis - security auditing tool for Unix based systems
ratpoison - keyboard-only window manager
torcs - 3D racing cars simulator game using OpenGL
wpagui - graphical user interface for wpa_supplicant
Legitimate "recommends" [AFAICT]:
choosewm - fake x-session-manager allowing the user to choose a wm
education-desktop-kde - Debian Edu KDE desktop applications
flwm - Fast Light Window Manager
icewm-common - wonderful Win95-OS/2-Motif-like window manager
menu-xdg - freedesktop.org menu compliant window manager scripts

Specious "suggests" relationship [AFAICT]:
bbmail - Mail notifier for Blackbox/Fluxbox
doc-linux-html - Linux HOWTOs and FAQs in HTML format
doc-linux-ja-html - Linux HOWTOs and FAQs in Japanese (HTML format)
doc-linux-nonfree-htm - Linux HOWTOs in HTML format (non-free)
fish - a friendly interactive shell
fityk - general-purpose nonlinear curve fitting and data analysi
genesis - general-purpose neural simulator
geneweb - genealogy software with web interface
libreoffice - office productivity suite
lyx - document processor
mhc-utils - command line/GUI utilities for the MHC schedule manageme
mirage - fast and simple GTK+ image viewer
rio - A command line Diamond Rio MP3 player controller
rox-filer - A simple graphical file manager for X11
sopwith - port of the 1980's side-scrolling WWI dogfighting game
synaptic - Graphical package manager
trayer - Lightweight GTK2-based systray for UNIX desktop
tucnak2 - VHF/UHF/SHF Hamradio contest log version 2
tuxeyes - a fancy version of xeyes
upgrade-system - system upgrader from Funkyware and Konflux
w3m - WWW browsable pager with excellent tables/frames support
wings3d - Nendo-inspired 3D polygon mesh modeller
xiterm+thai - X terminal program with Thai languague support
xmahjongg - tile-based solitaire game
xvt - X terminal-emulator similar to xterm, but smaller
Legitimate "suggest" [AFAICT]:
aewm - minimalist window manager for X11
blackbox - Window manager for X
deskmenu - A root menu for X11 window managers
fbpanel - lightweight X11 desktop panel
fvwm - F(?) Virtual Window Manager
fvwm-crystal - Pretty Desktop Environment based on fvwm
fvwm1 - Old version of the F(?) Virtual Window Manager
jwm - very small lightweight pure X11 window manager with tray
lxpanel - lightweight desktop panel for X
olvwm - OpenLook virtual window manager
olwm - Open Look Window Manager
openbox - standards compliant, fast, light-weight, extensible wind
pdmenu - simple console menu program
ratmenu - Creates X menus from the shell
sapphire - A minimal but configurable X11R6 window manager
sawfish - a window manager for X11
stumpwm - tiling, keyboard driven Common Lisp window manager
wmaker - NeXTSTEP-like window manager for X
wmanager - window-manager selection tool used at X startup
xfdesktop4 - xfce desktop background, icons and root menu manager


Among all the packages that depends, recommend or suggest on 'menu', I
have listed if one either provide a menu entry (/usr/share/menu/) in or
use the menu (/etc/menu-methods/).

+--+-+--++
|Package name |provide| use* | Dependency |
+--+-+--++
= |aewm | entry | method | suggests |
= |afterstep | entry | - | depends | => ?
= |awesome | entry | method | depends |
0 |backintime-gnome | - | - | depends |
0 |backintime-kde | - | - | depends |
0 |bbmail | - | - | suggests |
= |blackbox | entry | method | suggests |
0 |bleachbit | entry | - | depends |
~ |blends-common | entry | - | depends | => ?
0 |btnx-config | - | - | depends |
0 |bum | - | - | depends |
= |choosewm | entry | method | recommends |
= |deskmenu | - | method | suggests |
0 |disk-manager | entry | - | depends |
0 |dkms | - | - | recommends |
0 |doc-linux-html | - | - | suggests |
0 |doc-linux-ja-html | - | - | suggests |
0 |doc-linux-nonfree-htm | - | - | ? |
= |education-desktop-kde | - | - | recommends |
0 |etherape | entry | - | recommends |
= |fbpanel | entry | - | suggests |
0 |firestarter | entry | - | depends |
0 |fish | entry | - | suggests |
0 |fityk | entry | - | suggests |
= |fluxbox | entry | method | depends |
= |flwm | entry | method | recommends |
= |fvwm1 | entry | method | suggests |
= |fvwm-crystal | - | method | suggests |
= |fvwm | entry | method | suggests |
0 |gadmin-bind | entry | - | depends |
0 |gadmin-openvpn-client | entry | - | depends |
0 |gadmin-openvpn-server | entry | - | depends |
0 |gadmin-proftpd | entry | - | depends |
0 |gadmin-rsync | entry | - | depends |
0 |gadmin-samba | entry | - | depends |
0 |genesis | entry | - | suggests |
0 |geneweb | entry | - | suggests |
0 |grub-choose-default | entry | - | depends |
0 |gsmartcontrol | entry | - | depends |
0 |gsql | entry | - | depends |
0 |gtkorphan | - | - | depends |
= |icewm-common | - | method | recommends |
~ |junior-config | - | - | depends |
= |jwm | entry | method | suggests |
0 |keytouch-editor | entry | - | recommends |
0 |kvpnc | entry | - | depends |
0 |libreoffice | - | - | suggests |
0 |luckybackup | entry | - | depends |
= |lxpanel | - | - | suggests |
0 |lynis | entry | - | recommends |
0 |lyx | entry | - | suggests |
~ |med-config | - | - | depends |
= |menu-xdg | - | method | recommends |
0 |mhc-utils | entry | - | suggests |
0 |mirage | entry | - | suggests |
= |motif-clients | - | method | depends |
0 |ndisgtk | entry | - | depends |
= |olvwm | entry | method | suggests |
= |olwm | entry | method | suggests |
= |openbox | entry | method | suggests |
= |pdmenu | entry | method | suggests |
= |pekwm | entry | method | depends |
= |ratmenu | - | method | suggests |
0 |ratpoison | entry | method | recommends |
0 |rio | entry | - | suggests |
0 |rox-filer | entry | - | suggests |
0 |rutilt | entry | - | depends |
= |sapphire | entry | method | suggests |
= |sawfish | entry | method | suggests |
~ |science-config | - | - | depends |
0 |sopwith | entry | - | suggests |
0 |startupmanager | entry | - | depends |
= |stumpwm | entry | - | suggests |
0 |synaptic | entry | - | suggests |
0 |system-config-audit | - | - | depends |
0 |system-config-cluster | - | - | depends |
0 |system-config-lvm | - | - | depends |
~ |task-desktop | - | - | depends |
0 |torcs | entry | - | recommends |
0 |trayer | - | - | suggests |
0 |tucnak2 | entry | - | suggests |
0 |tuxeyes | entry | - | suggests |
= |twm | entry | method | depends |
0 |upgrade-system | - | - | suggests |
0 |w3m | entry | - | suggests |
0 |wifi-radar | entry | - | depends |
0 |wings3d | entry | - | suggests |
= |wmaker | entry | method | suggests |
= |wmanager | - | method | suggests |
0 |wpagui | entry | - | recommends |
0 |xball | entry | - | depends |
= |xfdesktop4 | entry | - | suggests |
0 |xiterm+thai | entry | - | suggests |
0 |xmahjongg | entry | - | suggests |
0 |xvt | entry | - | suggests |
+--+-+--++
Legend:
Provide: The package provide a file in /usr/share/menu/
Use: The package provide a file in /etc/menu-methods/
Depends: type of dependency on on menu package.
My Flags:
0 : Remove any dependency [AFAICT]
= : Don't chage anything [AFAICT]
~ : Consider switching from depends to recommends



Laszlo Boszormenyi (GCS) <gcs@debian.hu>
tuxeyes

Cosimo Alfarano <kalfa@debian.org>
blends (U)

Ben Armstrong <synrg@sanctuary.nslug.ns.ca>
debian-junior (U)

Romain Beauxis <toots@rastageeks.org>
rutilt (U)

Stephen Birch <sgbirch@imsmail.org>
xball

Fathi Boudra <fabo@debian.org>
kvpnc (U)

Kjell Braden <fnord@pentabarf.de>
grub-choose-default

Francisco Manuel Garcia Claramonte <francisco@debian.org>
lynis

Kevin Coyner <kcoyner@debian.org>
bbmail

Paul Cupis <paul@cupis.co.uk>
firestarter

Luke Cycon <lcycon@gmail.com>
keytouch-editor

HIGUCHI Daisuke <debian@vdr.jp>
w3m (U)

Debian Erlang Packagers <pkg-erlang-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
wings3d

Debian Games Team <pkg-games-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
xmahjongg

Debian Hamradio Maintainers <debian-hams@lists.debian.org>
tucnak2

Debian Install System Team <debian-boot@lists.debian.org>
tasksel

Debian Junior <debian-jr@lists.debian.org>
debian-junior

Debian KDE Extras Team <pkg-kde-extras@lists.alioth.debian.org>
kvpnc

Debian LDP Maintainers <pkg-doc-linux-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
doc-linux

Debian LibreOffice Maintainers <debian-openoffice@lists.debian.org>
libreoffice

Debian LyX Maintainers <pkg-lyx-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
lyx

Debian Med Packaging Team <debian-med-packaging@lists.alioth.debian.org>
debian-med

Debian Pure Blend Team <debian-blends@lists.debian.org>
blends

Debian Ralink packages maintainers <pkg-ralink-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org>
rutilt

Debian Science Team <debian-science-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org>
debian-science

Debian/Ubuntu wpasupplicant Maintainers <pkg-wpa-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
wpasupplicant

Dynamic Kernel Modules Support Team <pkg-dkms-maint@lists.alioth.debian.org>
dkms

Rene Engelhard <rene@debian.org>
libreoffice (U)

Luca Falavigna <dktrkranz@debian.org>
bleachbit

Rudy Godoy <rudy@debian.org>
torcs

Sergei Golovan <sgolovan@debian.org>
wings3d (U)

Federico Di Gregorio <fog@debian.org>
bum (U)

Debian QA Group <packages@qa.debian.org>
gadmin-bind
gadmin-openvpn-client
gadmin-openvpn-server
gadmin-samba

Philipp Matthias Hahn <pmhahn@debian.org>
audit

Joey Hess <joeyh@debian.org>
tasksel (U)

Sven Hoexter <hoexter@debian.org>
lyx (U)

Philipp Huebner <debalance@debian.org>
btnx-config
system-config-cluster
system-config-lvm

Ben Hutchings <ben@decadent.org.uk>
rutilt (U)

Giuseppe Iuculano <iuculano@debian.org>
dkms (U)
gsmartcontrol

Aurelien Jarno <aurel32@debian.org>
rutilt (U)

Tatsuya Kinoshita <tats@debian.org>
mhc
w3m

Julian Andres Klode <jak@debian.org>
ndisgtk

Sylvestre Ledru <sylvestre@debian.org>
debian-science (U)

Frederic Daniel Luc Lehobey <Frederic@Lehobey.net>
debian-science (U)

Frank Lichtenheld <djpig@debian.org>
doc-linux (U)

Mario Limonciello <Mario_Limonciello@dell.com>
dkms (U)

Bernhard R. Link <brlink@debian.org>
ratpoison

Stefan Lippers-Hollmann <s.l-h@gmx.de>
wpasupplicant (U)

Francesco Paolo Lovergine <frankie@debian.org>
rox

Fabio Marzocca <thesaltydog@gmail.com>
bum
gtkorphan

GOTO Masanori <gotom@debian.org>
doc-linux-ja

Patrick Matthài <pmatthaei@debian.org>
luckybackup

Kel Modderman <kel@otaku42.de>
wpasupplicant (U)

Hamish Moffatt <hamish@debian.org>
tucnak2 (U)

Vince Mulhollon <vlm@debian.org>
rio

Per Olofsson <pelle@debian.org>
lyx (U)

Xavier Oswald <xoswald@debian.org>
mirage

Patrick Ouellette <pouelle@debian.org>
tucnak2 (U)

Sam Hocevar (Debian packages) <sam+deb@zoy.org>
genesis
xvt

David Paleino <dapal@debian.org>
disk-manager
dkms (U)

Peter Pentchev <roam@ringlet.net>
xmahjongg (U)

Christian Perrier <bubulle@debian.org>
geneweb

Frederic Peters <fpeters@debian.org>
etherape

Estêvão Samuel Procópio <tevaum@gmail.com>
gsql

Kenneth J. Pronovici <pronovic@debian.org>
sopwith

Mark Purcell <msp@debian.org>
kvpnc (U)

Python Applications Packaging Team <python-apps-team@lists.alioth.debian.org>
bleachbit (U)
startupmanager

Martin-Éric Racine <martin-eric.racine@iki.fi>
upgrade-system

Petter Reinholdtsen <pere@debian.org>
blends (U)

Jaime Robles <jaime@debian.org>
tucnak2 (U)

Marco Rodrigues <gothicx@sapo.pt>
startupmanager (U)

José L. Redrejo Rodríguez <jredrejo@debian.org>
blends (U)

Otavio Salvador <otavio@debian.org>
tasksel (U)

Jens Peter Secher <jps@debian.org>
trayer

Carlo Segre <segre@debian.org>
fityk

Gustavo Noronha Silva <kov@debian.org>
fish

Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk>
blends (U)

Neutron Soutmun <neo.neutron@gmail.com>
xiterm+thai

Mahyuddin Susanto <udienz@ubuntu.com>
gadmin-proftpd
gadmin-rsync

Andreas Tille <tille@debian.org>
blends (U)
debian-junior (U)
debian-med (U)
debian-science (U)

Cesare Tirabassi <norsetto@ubuntu.com>
rutilt (U)

Michael Vogt <mvo@debian.org>
synaptic

Colin Watson <cjwatson@debian.org>
doc-linux (U)

Jonathan Wiltshire <jmw@debian.org>
backintime

Patrick Winnertz <winnie@debian.org>
wifi-radar



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